Sudden increase? Westbank 14 (=17) storey tower revised proposal for Broadway & Alma: Rezoning open house 13-Feb-2020 (Thu)

3701-3743 West Broadway at Alma rezoning image Feb 2020

City Rezoning Open House for 3701-3743 West Broadway (at Alma St.)
February 13, 2020 (Thursday)
5 – 8 pm
St. James Community Square (3214 West 10th Avenue)

(Updated) Intro: The public and professionals in the urban development community have the right to get some clear answers on this proposed project by Westbank Projects Corp. What discussions have gone on behind the scenes? It’s time for some spotlights. The project was initially proposed and public input sought for 6 storeys. Quietly, the proposal later rose to 12 and now stated as 14 storeys. The city’s website currently indicates a height of 172 feet (but the rule of thumb for height is 10 feet per floors, so this is actually equivalent to 17 storeys). When we first made our post, the City’s feedback form and developer’s drawings indicated 220 feet (equivalent to 22 storeys). Upon inquiry, on Feb 10 we got a response that the feedback page was incorrect, and it was later corrected.

[Update 6 – The City replied and corrected the error noted above, but Westbank did not respond.]

[Update 7 – If you arrived here from the apparently-omniscient “CityDuo” mystery writers’ March 2 blog post, please note that they refer repeatedly to the “floor” count in the proposal. This CityHallWatch post has no major problem with the “floor” count but rather with the height count (in storeys and in feet or meters).  For further understanding of the crucial points of this post, search for the key words “precedent” and “wiggle” room on this page — how the usual rule-of-thumb in Vancouver is 10 feet per storey. How this application could later morph into more floors and floor space to benefit the developer (as we have seen in reality other developments), and how the precedent could affect several other development sites currently in play and drive speculation in the area. CityDuo misses all of that. They also miss the scenario of many towers being built, but no rail/transit/subway line prospect for many years, if ever. The CityDuo tone and style often seems to pick up the most extreme comments to paint with one brush and belittle community concerns regarding a given rezoning or development application. And one also wonders how they appear to be party to many of the spoken and written comments made at open house events. Hence the term omniscient….]

This rezoning would set a major precedent for the neighbourhood. Is the public consultation going to be adequate in extent and in good faith? Within just a couple blocks sit two major development sites currently sitting empty except for so-called “community gardens,” which are saving the property owners millions of dollars in property taxes. What happens with this Westbank site at Broadway and Alma will likely set a precedent and lock-in developer expectations for those two sites, and many more along a hypothetical transit route. This project could trigger land price escalation in the entire area, driving out small businesses and driving up speculation. Council needs to discuss all of this with eyes wide open and put the long-term public interest first.  If the $4.6 billion (likely to dramatically increase) in funding for an Arbutus to UBC SkyTrain never comes due to the many competing transit priorities (federal, provincial, and regional), the local communities could be looking at many new towers, but no major transit improvements.

Does this proposal prove that a development frenzy is the guaranteed outcome of any talk about a Broadway subway? The application is being considered under the “Moderate Income Rental Housing Pilot Program.”

The “Broadway Subway” segment from VCC Clark to Arbutus Street is still many years away.  The proposed SkyTrain extension to UBC is estimated now at $4.6 billion but likely to come in at double that amount if it ever gets built. Who pays for all this? Riders and taxpayers.

The proposed rezoning includes (from current data on City website):

  • a total of 153 secured rental units (with 20% of the residential floor area assigned to moderate income households);
  • commercial uses at grade;
  • a total floor space ratio (FSR) of 5.3;
  • a total floor area of 11,537.4 sq. m (124,187.5 sq. ft.);
  • a maximum height of 52.63 m (172.7 ft.) ; and
  • 53 underground parking stalls and 301 bike spaces.

You can read more through the City’s website here:
https://rezoning.vancouver.ca/applications/3701-3743wbroadway/index.htm

The application has been made under the Moderate Income Rental Housing Pilot Program. You can learn more about the enabling policy online here:
https://bylaws.vancouver.ca/zoning/policy-rezoning-mirhpp.pdf

CityHallWatch comment: For the record…One poster at the Feb 13 open house explained this program: “MIRHPP proposals can be considered in a range of zones across the city that currently allow residential development, each with different opportunities for maximum building heights (number of storeys).” We observe here that the City sees building height as equivalent to the number of storeys.  As we mention in this article, the City and Westbank claim the building is 14 storeys. However in terms of height, we assert that it is 17 storeys. Further clarification is needed.

City staff and the applicant team will be available to answer questions.

For more information and to submit comments, please contact the rezoning planner.

City Contact: Carly Rosenblat, Rezoning Planner, carly.rosenblat@vancouver.ca, 604-829-9621

Applicant Contact: Farouk Babul, Westbank Corp., farouk@westbankcorp.com, 604-685-8986

*****

CHW comments: For all rezoning application and development applications the applicant and City should ideally state the height in BOTH the number of storeys AND the overall height in feet and meters. Not just one or the other. There have been past cases in Vancouver where the “wiggle room” created by ambiguity creates the opportunity for back room deals after application approval, once the public process has already been completed. The Rize (renamed as The Independent) at Broadway and Main is one example where the building envelope height was retained, but the developer was able to squeeze in more storeys at development permit stage. That means more square footage, and more profits. The same would happen if only storeys are listed. If after the public process and Council approval of an application, direct discussions between the developer and a few City staff could result in each storey having higher ceiling heights, resulting in an increase in the overall building height, a bulkier building, and most likely, greater profits for the applicant.

The public, when being asked for public comment, needs to have useful references on the human scale. Most people would have an easier time envisioning a building height in storeys than in feet and meters. All these numbers (storeys, feet, meters) should be clearly stated on the rezoning notice board displayed on-site, plus all related documents and web pages listing the application specifications. (Note – as a general rule of thumb, the typical one storey is about 10 feet.)

The average person may also find the numbers on application documents to be confusing — on some documents the building height is indicated. On others, the elevation above sea level. In many cases, that difference and its significance might not be obvious to the person untrained in the field of architecture and planning.

*****

Below: Elevations from the proponent’s package are shown below. Useful to count the storeys.

3701 W Broadway cross-section screenshot DL 9-Feb-2020

. 3701 W Broadway cross-section screenshot DL 9-Feb-2020a

 

3701 W Broadway data screenshot 9-Feb-2020

Non-disclosure of the number of storeys makes it harder for people to evaluate what is being proposed and compare with the human scale of the neighbourhood. Note that on Feb 10, City staff responded that the 220 foot number in the Feedback form was incorrect and later revised.

*****

How many storeys is this application really for? Here is one count showing 17 storeys, not 14.

3701-3743 WBroadway Alma image STOREY COUNT rev

 

3 thoughts on “Sudden increase? Westbank 14 (=17) storey tower revised proposal for Broadway & Alma: Rezoning open house 13-Feb-2020 (Thu)

  1. Just fyi the height hasn’t changed since the last revision — it’s still 14 storeys: https://rezoning.vancouver.ca/applications/3701-3743wbroadway/documents/3701-3743WBroadway-BuildingElevations.pdf

    Regarding the height, it’s 67.28m measured from below ground. The average building grade is 14.66m, and the highest point is 67.28m, giving you the height 52.63m: https://rezoning.vancouver.ca/applications/3701-3743wbroadway/documents/3701-3743WBroadway-Stats.pdf

    Average building grade is “the lowest of the average levels of finished ground adjoining each exterior wall of a building, except that localized depressions need not be considered in the determination of average levels of finished ground.”

    Building height “means the number of storeys contained between the roof and the floor of the first storey”

    Storey “means that portion of a building that is situated between the top of any floor and the top of the floor next above it, and if there is no floor above it, that portion between the top of such floor and the ceiling above it.”

    Click to access calculating-building-height.pdf

    • Response to Kevant. We received this response which seems to refute your interpretation. We’ll be writing to Westbank and City Hall for confirmation/explanation. See also the image of the elevations, added to the post.

      First, on any of the city notifications or the site notice board there is no disclosure of the number of storeys proposed.
      A careful count of the elevations from the proponent’s documentation (from the rezoning web page) the actual count is 17 storeys, not 14. See the elevations image now added to the post. What Westbank is describing as “Level 1” is actually TWO storeys at 20 feet. In addition, the top two storeys are referred to as “Roof Levels.”

      Meanwhile, the city’s feedback form states the height at 67.28m/220.75 ft. and this contradicts the City’s rezoning application web page, which says 52.63m/ 172.7 ft.

      Therefore, it would seem that the City’s feedback form is erroneously consulting on a 220 foot building rather than a 172 foot building. Which is it? Note that in both cases there is no reference to the NUMBER of storeys, although on the elevation drawings clearly appear to show 17 storeys.
      City Rezoning Application Link:
      https://rezoning.vancouver.ca/applications/3701-3743wbroadway/index.htm
      City Feedback Form:
      https://rezoning.vancouver.ca/applications/3701-3743wbroadway/feedback.htm

  2. 1. The picture of the proposed building is ugly.
    2. Large, deep-rooting trees on the roof will break through the water barrier in very few years. Don’t do it!

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